30 October 2008 @ 06:15 pm
Spike: After the Fall, Issue 4  
Amazing. This actually beats Issue 3 as my favourite Spike: After the Fall issue.

What's been remarkable about this series from the start is that it's not just pointless fanservice (which could have been an option for a lesser writer than Brian, since people would have bought the series even if it was just "88 pages of Spike sitting around shirtless, chained up, snarking about Angel and thinking passionate and inspiring thoughts about his one true Slayer love", as King of Cretins put it) -- but in fact, Spike: After the Fall informs the main Angel: After the Fall series in many, many ways, and this issue more than any other. Brian called it a "game-changer", in that "it will make you look at all the other ATF issues that have come out in a different light", so I will assume this is the final word on a much-debated subject...

Fred is dead, has been dead all along. What we've been watching all this time... is Illyria.

The Sadecki demon functions much in the same way as the Judge in Innocence, like [info]angearia very accurately pointed out, or -- I will add -- Drogyn in A Hole in the World. A character who drains humanity to tell us that there's no humanity in Angelus. A character who can tell no lies to tell us that there's no way to save Fred. And now a character who can influence any lifeform, to tell us the nature of Frillyria's lifeform. "There's nothing human about her. She wants it! She's trying to force it... but there's nothing left but -- Illyria."

Needless to say, this is huge for Illyria's character, and immeasurably more interesting than the alternative (Fred body-sharing with Illyria) would have been. She wants it. She's trying to force it. This from the character who disparaged humanity and all its associated weaknesses every chance she got, when she first appeared in the series.

Now that the cat's come out of the bag, her transformations to Fred break your heart and creep you out by turns; you've got moments to remind you how far she's come, like her wobbly, vulnerable "It's scary, I know --" (nailed, I mean nailed by Franco), and moments to remind you that she may wear Fred's face, but she's still Illyria, like her straight-faced "You told me, Spike. No-one... matters... but... me."

So -- and again, this is only applicable if this is the final say on the mystery, as most people believe (and as Brian has led us to believe) -- Wesley had it right. ("She's confused by Gunn's sudden re-appearance, so she's doing what Fred would have done when she didn't understand something. She has no idea what to look for but it's making her feel better.") He knows them both so well. Spike, on the other hand, seems to be in denial about the whole thing, which, very in-character for him. He feels like he's protecting Fred like he couldn't protect her in A Hole in the World, or Dawn and consequently Buffy in The Gift (as James Marsters said: "In my own mind, I killed her. ... I failed up there completely. I was supposed to protect her and Dawn, and I absolutely failed." ... "Big time guilt about that. Huge").

Not surprisingly, all the best scenes in this issue are Illyria-centric, and they're all -- and this is a compliment I don't give out lightly, so savour it while it lasts -- as good as anything that's been done with her in the televised series. Until this issue, I honestly didn't think that could be done. At any rate: topping the list are the two aforementioned moments, along with the scene of Illyria "strengthening their flock" by ensuring Jeremy's "absence". Ouch. We all expected Jeremy to die, at least in the back of our minds, but no-one could have imagined he would die in this manner. Further proof that death doesn't have to be "gratuitous" in this 'verse, as some readers seem to be complaining these days -- not when it gives the remaining characters (like Illyria and Spike here) such huge moments. Bring on the delicious pain, Brian. (Illyria's "Tell me I was right to do it" plea, followed by that haunting panel of Jeremy's dead body, makes for one of the most shocking character deaths in the whole 'verse -- and here we thought it would be among the most predictable ones!)

I loved Spike in this issue, too. The Spike-Connor rapport was funny and adorable; he's definitely the boy's "cool uncle" in this weird family dynamic. (Can we get a dream sequence with Angel, Darla, Connor and Spike playing Scrabble together, pretty please?) Spike swearing off "attachments" on account of what happened to his previous attachments, most recently Jeremy, was very sad and believable, too. His affair with Spider makes even more sense when viewed from that perspective, although I'm not surprised to see he's become a little more attached than he had intended to. (This issue is not likely to improve people's opinion of her, by the way, with the Charmed reference. *g*)

Also, this is not likely to interest anyone but me, but... what is up with Spike and musicals? LOL! He appears to be acquainted with "My Fair Lady" ("By George, I think he's got it!"), "The Music Man" (The day you suss out what you do want, there'll probably be a parade. Seventy-six bloody trombones"), "Les Misérables" ("Trust me, halfway through the first act, you'll be drinking humans again"), and now "Starlight Express". No wonder he gets along with Lorne. (Loved that little nod, by the way. Canonize Asylum and Shadow Puppets already!)

Also loved that the Hugh Hefner jokes that had been running rampant in the forums for months were made textual. Hee!

Franco has a lot to do with the awesomeness of this issue, too, since he did some of his best work here. The first panel featuring the Sadecki, the "nothing human about her" Illyria panel, the "It's scary, I know --" Illyria-as-Fred panel, Jeremy's death and Spike's reaction to it, the time-travel sequence, that simplistic and simultaneously loaded panel of Illyria-as-Fred holding her hand... wow. I didn't like the colouring, but I've gotten used to not liking it by now, so it didn't really detract from my enjoyment.

The only thing I can think of that took me out of the moment was Connor's "Feed you, how? Like, a date? Because that is inappropriate and ill-timed, and I kinda like someone else", which seemed... inappropriate and ill-timed. ;) Oh, and I thought the last few pages moved a bit slowly. However, these things were barely a blip in my radar compared to the Good Stuff, so I give it...

9/10

(I do wish certain people on the forums would stop clinging to a character that died one season ago -- and this after Joss had met the resurrection-quota required for people to throw up their hands and cry "No More" -- to the point that they can't enjoy the story for what it is. Especially when they so obviously do it for 'shippy reasons, i.e. to give Wesley a happy, or to hook her up with Spike and clear the way for Angel/Buffy. It's a bit unnerving to see, although it can't be helped.)
 
 
Current Mood: impressed
 
 
( 20 comments — Post a new comment )
sueworld2003: Warning may contain[info]sueworld2003 on October 30th, 2008 10:20 pm (UTC)
"What's been remarkable about this series from the start is that it's not just pointless fanservice (which could have been an option for a lesser writer than Brian, since people would have bought the series even if it was just "88 pages of Spike sitting around shirtless, chained up, snarking about Angel and thinking passionate and inspiring thoughts about his one true Slayer love", as King of Cretins put it)"

Oh come off it like he'd know. A) He has a habit of calling anything that serves Spike well/he doesn't approve of in a story as 'Fan service', and B) when did KOC become the arbiter of good taste when it comes to all things Spike? He's hardly an unbiased judge eh? *g*

On the whole I adored this last issue. It's as a shame that it appears many haven't placed as much importance on this compared to the likes of AtF or season 8 because I thought it actually felt the most like the show and punched a real emotional package with Jeremy's death at the hands of Illyria, the tainted innocent. As you say we all saw it coming but not the manner in which it was done.

A really strong issue which really didn't pull any punches.

Edited at 2008-10-30 10:22 pm (UTC)
enisy: Wesley/Illyria (War in Your Head)[info]enisy on October 30th, 2008 10:49 pm (UTC)
Thanks for replying! *huggles*

Oh come off it like he'd know. A) He has a habit of calling anything that serves Spike well/he doesn't approve of in a story as 'Fan service', and B) when did KOC become the arbiter of good taste when it comes to all things Spike? He's hardly an unbiased judge eh? *g*

I just thought that quote was funneh. ;)

On the whole I adored this last issue. It's as a shame that it appears many haven't placed as much importance on this compared to the likes of AtF or season 8 because I thought it actually felt the most like the show and punched a real emotional package with Jeremy's death at the hands of Illyria, the tainted innocent. As you say we all saw it coming but not the manner in which it was done.

Yes, I agree! This is the first comic issue that rose to the level of the televised series in my eyes. It was just stunning.

A really strong issue which really didn't pull any punches.

We'll be hearing a lot of whining from the Fred enthusiasts in the next few days, I expect, but large risks make for larger-than-life stories. I'm in love with this development. I really couldn't have handled another resurrection.
sueworld2003: Doh![info]sueworld2003 on October 30th, 2008 10:56 pm (UTC)
"I just thought that quote was funneh. ;)"

Hmmmm it probaly would be If you didn't know who it came from...*g*

"We'll be hearing a lot of whining from the Fred enthusiasts in the next few days, I expect,"

Could you phrase that a wee bit nicer. Remember your a fan of a ship thats to all intensive purposes a 'dead one', so I would have thought you'd have a bit more patiance with those who'd like the character alive.
enisy: All (Why We Read)[info]enisy on October 30th, 2008 11:04 pm (UTC)
Meep, sorry about that. I was thinking of the Fred enthusiasts of the variety that I described in my last couple of sentences there ("Especially ...") -- not nice ones like [info]sockmonkeyhere -- so I inevitably got a little eye-roll-y. I'll go edit. :)

ETA: ...would if I could, at any rate.

Edited at 2008-10-30 11:06 pm (UTC)
Shapinglight[info]shapinglight on October 31st, 2008 08:20 am (UTC)
Nice review. Sue's already covered my quibbles with it, which are the same as hers.

I was going to mention the musical thing. I just can't imagine Spike as a fan of musical theatre - Angel yes, Spike no.

Odd. When I do the poll thing on IDW I'll mention it, or maybe you could?
enisy: Spike (WTF Joss)[info]enisy on October 31st, 2008 08:46 am (UTC)
I already mentioned it in my review there. I don't necessarily think it's out of character, though; I mean, he watches melodrama like Passions and Dawson's Creek, and musical theatre is where the word "melodrama" originated. ;) (But if it helps, we know he at least didn't like two of the four musicals he's mentioned. :P)

Nice review. Sue's already covered my quibbles with it, which are the same as hers.

Well, King has been nothing but nice to me, so I don't mind giving him a nod here and there, even though I know he doesn't get along with many of my other friends. As for the Fred thing, I can't mention any names, but you and [info]sueworld2003 can probably guess which posts in which forums are ruffling my feathers.

Edited at 2008-10-31 08:56 am (UTC)
sueworld2003: Capt Jack seriously?!![info]sueworld2003 on October 31st, 2008 10:28 am (UTC)
When even when he was 'shouting the odds' on Slayalive, and all those endless bitter little digs at your shipping preferences on various boards?

Considering you obviously took offense to what a few harmless Fred shippers where saying (lets leave Cheryl's' comments out of this of course) I'd have thought you'd realised where he was 'coming from' so to speak.

But hey, 'horses for courses' and all that. *g*



enisy: Spuffy (Destroyer of Worlds)[info]enisy on October 31st, 2008 11:18 am (UTC)
When even when he was 'shouting the odds' on Slayalive, and all those endless bitter little digs at your shipping preferences on various boards?

If we're talking about the same SlayAlive incident, his comments there did bother me, but we've exchanged PMs about it since, so. *shrugs* And I don't mind the digs at my 'shipping preferences, because I don't view them as digs.

Considering you obviously took offense to what a few harmless Fred shippers where saying (lets leave Cheryl's' comments out of this of course)

I didn't take offense at what the harmless Fred 'shippers were saying. As I said, you can probably guess which posts bothered me, and they weren't made by "harmless Fred 'shippers". ;)
sueworld2003: Giles Good Grief![info]sueworld2003 on October 31st, 2008 11:30 am (UTC)
"And I don't mind the digs at my 'shipping preferences, because I don't view them as digs."

You don't?!! Blimey, I think you're in the minority there with that one love. :)

As to Fred shipper comments I've really only seen Cheryl's and Sockies myself. But then I've hardly been to Darkhorse recently.
enisy: Wesley/Illyria (Touch)[info]enisy on October 31st, 2008 11:50 am (UTC)
You don't?!! Blimey, I think you're in the minority there with that one love. :)

LOL, I know I am. -- And I admit I am a little biased. He does sometimes get needlessly cynical about 'ships involving Buffy and Xander that aren't Xander/Buffy... see Spike/Buffy, see Spike/Xander, see Angel/Buffy, etc. But hey, my 'shipping behaviour isn't always stellar, either, so I cut him some slack.

As to Fred shipper comments I've really only seen Cheryl's and Sockies myself. But then I've hardly been to Darkhorse recently.

Haven't seen Socky's, but I'm certain they wouldn't have bothered me if I had. She's a genuine Spike, Fred and Spike/Fred fan, not by proxy.
sueworld2003: Angel smirk[info]sueworld2003 on October 31st, 2008 12:02 pm (UTC)
"He does sometimes get needlessly cynical about 'ships involving Buffy and Xander that aren't Xander/Buffy..."

Only sometimes...*g* Any opportunity he gets to undermine someone else's opinions on why they love what they do he's in there.

I've just been over to Darkhorse and seen your 'conversation' with Cheryl. Is that the kind of thing you're referring too then?
enisy: Illyria (More Violence)[info]enisy on October 31st, 2008 12:34 pm (UTC)
Only sometimes...*g* Any opportunity he gets to undermine someone else's opinions on why they love what they do he's in there.

Well, he's not the only one. Most Xander/Buffy fans seem to have grown bitter after being denied their 'ship for about a decade. (What bothers me a bit is that they keep criticising the more "mainstream" 'shippers, when they really ought to check their temper at the door first. -- Although of course there are exceptions, like XavierZane or Wolfie.)

I've just been over to Darkhorse and seen your 'conversation' with Cheryl. Is that the kind of thing you're referring too then?

Not gonna rag on anyone directly in a public entry, but I'll say that DarkHorse, SlayAlive and certain 'shippy forums (not CDS, obviously) are a breeding ground for the kind of posts that push my buttons. :P
sueworld2003: Crazy[info]sueworld2003 on October 31st, 2008 12:41 pm (UTC)
Yeah Slayalive isn't the most Spike friendly board I've ever seen *g* but then I put that down to the fact the average poster seems on the young side.

The same with Darkhorse realy.

enisy: Spangel (Forehead Kiss)[info]enisy on October 31st, 2008 12:56 pm (UTC)
Yeah Slayalive isn't the most Spike friendly board I've ever seen *g* but then I put that down to the fact the average poster seems on the young side.

So I'm not the only one who noticed that! That's what I thought, too. And yeah, not very Spike-friendly at all; it brings me near the end of my tether on a daily basis. *grumble*
sueworld2003: Careful now![info]sueworld2003 on October 31st, 2008 02:03 pm (UTC)
No it's not just you. A few folks who have gone and looked at the board suspected that a loooong time ago.

Just young and immature is how I view their attitude.
sueworld2003: Capt Jack seriously?!![info]sueworld2003 on November 2nd, 2008 01:14 pm (UTC)
I just went over to look at the Spuffy thread on there. Jesus, some things never change do they?

Young twits who happen to be Bangel fans shouting the odds at others who don't share their obsession being one of them..:0

I'm amazed that the owner of the board chose to show himself up by acting the same, even in jest.
Shapinglight: Comics cover Spike[info]shapinglight on November 1st, 2008 04:26 pm (UTC)
I don't necessarily think it's out of character, though

No, I don't either, but I suspect it's something he keeps quiet about as a rule.

Well, King has been nothing but nice to me,

He wasn't so nice that time on Slayalive.

As for the posts you mean, if it's something on Dark Horse, I wouldn't know, as I never look at that board these days. However, I can imagine the sort of thing you mean and can only say that certain fan groups are just desperate to pack Spike away somewhere where he can't get in the way of the true love of whichever happens to be their OTP, and will clutch at any old straw that comes along.



Edited at 2008-11-01 08:13 pm (UTC)
sueworld2003: Giles Good Grief![info]sueworld2003 on November 2nd, 2008 01:18 pm (UTC)
just went over to look at the Spuffy thread on the Slayalive board. Jesus, some things never change do they?

Young twits who happen to be Bangel fans shouting the odds at others who don't share their obsession being one of them..:0

I'm amazed that the owner of the board chose to show himself up by acting the same, even in jest.

"Well, King has been nothing but nice to me,

He wasn't so nice that time on Slayalive."

Ditto.


"As for the posts you mean, if it's something on Dark Horse, I wouldn't know, as I never look at that board these days. However, I can imagine the sort of thing you mean and can only say that certain fan groups are just desperate to pack Spike away somewhere where he can't get in the way of the true love of whichever happens to be their OTP, and will clutch at any old straw that comes along."

Oh dear old Cheryl's transparent as crystal on both there and on IDW with here Fred/Spike lurve.

She must think that some folks have very short memories or something. *g*
Shapinglight[info]shapinglight on November 2nd, 2008 05:35 pm (UTC)
I'm amazed that the owner of the board chose to show himself up by acting the same, even in jest.

Heh! I'm not.

Edited at 2008-11-02 05:37 pm (UTC)
Elena[info]moscow_watcher on November 5th, 2008 09:46 am (UTC)
I abstained from reading reviews before I could read the comics/ so I'm commenting only now. I love your ideas, and I mostly agree with you. As to the boards politics, Whedonverse has always been shipping-driven, so I'm not surprised that everything that is posted online boils down to ships. :)

what is up with Spike and musicals? LOL!

I suspect that it was just Joss channelling his inner musical fan. :) And now Brian tries to keep up the tradition! :)